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Citroen C3 1.4HDI 8V Sluggish

Posted By mikeandbryonyb Friday, January 20, 2017 1:31:36 PM
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mikeandbryonyb
 Posted Friday, January 20, 2017 1:31:36 PM
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Hi everyone, I have a 2005 Citroen C3 1.4HDI 8V with about 85,000 miles on the clock. Around November it started losing power. It still gets up to 70+mph on a motorway but it takes ages to get there. You have to rev it hard to get it to accelerate and even with your foot flat on the floor it doesn't accelerate well. We don't exactly thrash it, so I wasn't that bothered. But then I checked the fuel economy by resetting the trip computer and it was only doing 42.8mpg, compared to the average over the last 5000 miles of 61mpg! Hence I thought I should find out what the problem was. Our local garage suggested we tried disconnecting the mass air flow sensor which can be the source of issues, but it made no difference (the engine warning light came up when we did this). I took it in and they connected it up to a Delphi diagnostic unit. This picked up a glowplug fault and the faults on the air temperature and air inlet sensor (presumably from being disconnected). Nothing else. The test showed that the engine is achieving 435 mg/stroke static and just over 518 mg/stroke on a road test. We are thinking that maybe the wastegate is sticking or perhaps there is a turbo fault. Can anyone offer any advice?
Thema
 Posted Friday, January 20, 2017 2:19:46 PM
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As it's been looked at surely the garage checked actual against desired boost pressure?
It's certainly sounds like lack of boost but do bear in mind that doesn't necessarily mean it's a turbo issue. There is all the pipework and so on to look at as well. I do think though that to say try disconnecting the MAF is rather a poor way of working!

Peter
K And R
 Posted Friday, January 20, 2017 6:27:19 PM
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Mike

"This picked up a glowplug fault" so why did you garage not find out what coursed this fault code.


What is this actual code ? What is the actual engine Code ?


Kev.


"If you dont KNOW how it works, don,t try to test or fix it"
mikeandbryonyb
 Posted Saturday, January 21, 2017 3:32:11 PM
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Many thanks to Thema and K and R for the responses. To follow up on Thema's comment. The garage was I think trying to avoid me the cost of plugging the vehicle into their diagnostics, with a suggestion about something that they have known to have caused problems in the past. I have been using them for probably 20 years, and have been happy with their work. They are only a small garage. They didn't measure boost pressure. In response to Kev's query we discussed the P1351 fault (pre-postheating relay control circuit fault) and we thought this was just for the glow plugs. Is there a scenario in which the pre/post heating relay would cause sluggish power and poor fuel economy? I have attached the printout - we have assumed the P0104 and P0113 were from the removal of the connection to the mass air flow meter. From what both of you are saying it sounds like I need to take it either to a Citroen dealer or to a diesel diagnostic specialist. Last time I did this with my old Xantia the labour and diagnostic charges cost way more than the car! That's really what I was trying to avoid, but it sounds like I have no other option. Would that be your recommendation?
 Delphi C3 HDI 8V Scan.pdf (13 views, 359.80 KB)
K And R
 Posted Saturday, January 21, 2017 7:11:05 PM
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Mike

Very little to help in your info apart from it has EDC 16C34, Is it euro 4 ?



"This picked up a glowplug fault" with that fault it will not re-gen.


Kev.

"If you dont KNOW how it works, don,t try to test or fix it"
mikeandbryonyb
 Posted Sunday, January 22, 2017 6:13:59 PM
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Hi Kev, thanks for the response. I am pretty positive that it is Euro 4 compliant. I need to do a bit of investigation into the glowplugs I think, and get back to everyone.
Disgusted
 Posted Tuesday, January 24, 2017 6:20:18 AM
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I would sort out the glow plug problem first. I don't think your vehicle will have a DPF but it will use the glow plugs whilst driving to ensure sufficient combustion and will probably cut fuelling in the event of a glow plug fault (Ford use the same system and have done several of them).

Start by checking voltage and current draw on glow plugs. If you have voltage but no current, you will need new glow plugs. If no voltage, you will need to check voltage further up the circuit with reference to a wiring diagram.

If it does need new glow plugs, make sure you get good quality ones and torque them up correctly as I have seen the ends fall off on these engines causing a fair bit of damage.
wor-mate
 Posted Wednesday, January 25, 2017 8:14:29 AM
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I am with Disg get the glow system repaired asap, the longer they are in the cyl head inoperative the greater risk of the electrode carboning up leading them to snap on removal, ouch cyl head off.
mikeandbryonyb
 Posted Monday, February 06, 2017 1:28:23 PM
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Thanks for the advice everyone. In the end I took it earlier today into the Citroen dealership in York. They have told me that the glowplug fault cleared itself and there were no other faults on the ECU. The turbo is "all OK". They have said that they believe the fault is with the injectors which all need replacing. This seems far fetched to me, since the fuel economy seemed to step down rather than deteriorate slowly over time. I am back to square one. Any suggestions? I am currently tempted to go and trade it in/exchange it for a later model (being honest about the fuel economy of course)!
Thema
 Posted Monday, February 06, 2017 1:45:47 PM
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From your description I'm not convinced that it needs a set of injectors. Do you know how the Citroen dealer arrived at that diagnosis?
I'm tempted to say tell them to fit a new set but you won't pay if the lack of power and fuel consumption aren't fixed. But I doubt if they would go for that, it seems to be only us independents that are expected to work that way!Other than that I would want to be doing more testing of my own which would, and DO NOT take this as suggestions to change anything, include a leak off test on the injectors and a proper look at the MAF sensor output as well as some other stuff. But no idea about the heater plug code if it really has just gone away.


Peter

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